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POST-DEBATE QUESTIONS FROM DR. JOE SCHWARCZ TO DR. ANDRÉ SAINE

These questions were posted by Dr. Joe Schwarcz to Dr. André Saine as a follow-up on the Debate held at McGill University on November 27, 2012.

QUESTION 1: Homeopaths claim that even after a substance is dissolved in water or alcohol and diluted to such an extent that there is not a single molecule of the original solute left, the solution still retains some memory of the solute. But this solution is then impregnated into a sugar pill and the water is evaporated. What then is left behind? And how does whatever is left behind have anything to do with healing?

Homeopaths are actually not making such a claim, but have instead been reporting a series of very important experimental observations that are, first, sick people are sensitive to remedies that can produce a similar state as their sickness1)]; second, patients usually experience an initial aggravation when remedies are precisely prescribed to them according to this principle of similarity2); third, to avoid this initial aggravation, Hahnemann did what any logical physician would do, he diminished the dose.

At first, he used simple dilutions3), and only many years later he began using serial succussed dilutions4)], a process he had previously used in chemistry5)] and which had been known at least since Paracelsus6); fourth, Hahnemann noticed that patients responded better and longer the higher the potency was, a fact that is confirmed daily by every practicing homeopath; and fifth, Hahnemann slowly pursued this upward process of serial dilution and succussion over the next forty years as he never stopped observing increasing benefit in the sick7). To illustrate how slow this process of progressive rise in serial trituration/succussion and dilutions was, Hahnemann recommended prescribing Aurum metallicum in the first and second attenuations in 1820, the 12th in 1825, the 30th in 1835 and by 1840 he was consistently using the 200 centesimal potency8)].

In view of these experimental facts, Hahnemann logically assumed that durable, physical changes were occurring in the vehicles due to this process of serial trituration/succussion and dilutions, a phenomenon that can absolutely not be explained with the theory of Avogadro's limit9). In 1825, he wrote, “By the succussion and trituration employed, a change is effected in the mixture, which is so incredibly great and so inconceivably curative, that this development of the spiritual power of medicines to such a height by means of the multiplied and continued trituration and succussion of a small portion of medicinal substance with ever more and more dry or fluid unmedicinal substances, deserves incontestably to be reckoned among the greatest discoveries of this age10).”

In the same article, Hahnemann responded to the skeptic's arguments about the implausibility of the higher attenuations as followed, “But there are various reasons why the skeptic ridicules these homeopathic attenuations. First, because he is ignorant that by means of such triturations the internal medicinal power is wonderfully developed, and is as it were liberated from its material bonds, so as to enable it to operate more penetratingly and more freely upon the human organism; secondly, because his purely arithmetical mind believes that it sees here only an instance of enormous subdivision, a mere material division and diminution, wherein every part must be less than the whole—as every child knows; but he does not observe, that in these spiritualizations of the internal medicinal power, the material receptacle of these natural forces, the palpable ponderable matter, is not to be taken into consideration at all; thirdly, because the skeptic has no experience relative to the action of preparations of such exalted medicinal power. If, then, he who pretends to be a seeker after truth will not search for it where it is to be found, namely, in experience, he will certainly fail to discover it; he will never find it by arithmetical calculations11).”

We could indeed speculate that beyond the twelfth centesimal dilution there isn't any molecule left from the original substance. However, no one can in fact prove the absence of any molecules of the original medicinal substances in ultra-molecular preparations (UMPs12)), unless they are able to investigate them with methods capable of detecting the presence of the smallest concentrations of molecules. It was not until the 1950's and 1960's that scientists conducted experiments with radioisotopes, which permitted the detection of molecules of the original substances in UMPs of up to the 10-2,000 (Korsakoff)13). The presence of the original medicinal substances have since been detected by more refined spectrometric measurements and most recently by scientists at the Indian Institute of Technology, who have detected asymptotic amounts of nanoparticles and nanobubbles in UMPs of up to the 10-400 14).

Also, measurable changes in the physico-chemical properties of UMPs began to appear in the 1940's with wavelength changes of the light passing through them15). Different teams of scientists corroborated other measurable physico-chemical changes of UMPs in the early 1950's16). During the 1960's, it was found by high-resolution nuclear magnetic resonance spectroscopy that differences existed in the alcohol phase spectrographs of UMPs17). The advent of more refined spectroscopic equipment is now permitting scientists to push investigation further and discover many new, greatly unexpected physico-chemical properties of UMPs.18) 19) 20)

In 1984, Scofield reviewed much of the pre-Benveniste research on the physico-chemical properties of UMPs21). We find that already in the 1960's, Barnard had developed the idea of the “memory of water,” or in other words, something of the original substances is ingrained in the vehicles, which had in fact been considered by homeopaths since Hahnemann22).

Why, we can ask, is the outcome of this research on the physico-chemical properties of UMPs so unwelcomed by skeptics but, at the same time, so welcomed by homeopaths? First, skeptics tend to approach homeopathy from a purely theoretical point of view, as it had been done for twenty-five centuries previous to the advent of experimental medicine. They have thus not been at all able to appreciate the facts presented by homeopaths, as they don't even bother examining them. Their whole argumentation lies on the theory of Avogadro's limit, and on the placebo response. They have never yet argued against the principle of similia, which is the fundamental basis of homeopathy. They believe so strongly in their theoretical argument that they don't even take the trouble to enquire into what homeopathy really is, or to examine the enumerable, wonderful facts reported in the vast homeopathic literature, which they perfunctorily reject with dismissive arrogance. Their theoretical scheme takes precedence over any fact, thus sacrificing truth at the altar of prejudice. Unfortunately, things have not changed much since 1828 when Jean Paul Ritcher said that homeopathy was more “detested than examined23)].”

On the other hand, homeopaths approach medicine as a natural science, which has as its basis the study of phenomena through observation. Observations reported by Hahnemann who was known to be an extremely meticulous and conscientious scientist have since been corroborated by hundreds of thousands of physicians and can be found throughout the vast homeopathic literature of more than 25,000 volumes.

The hypothesis of the memory of water is consistent with the series of experimental observations reported above. However, homeopaths are not claiming that there are no molecules left in UMPs, as insinuated by this question. We just couldn't have a clue until the 1950's when scientists began tracing radioisotopes in UMPs, which revealed the presence of the original substances in potencies up to the 1,000 centesimal Korsakoff. Scientists have so far detected at least two very important phenomena in UMPs, first, asymptotic amounts of nanoparticles and nanobubbles and, second, durable, physico-chemical changes of their vehicles.

In science, when a large body of evidence contradicts a theory it is time to change or adapt the theory, as Claude Bernard said so well in his Introduction to the Study of Experimental Medicine, “In these researches, I followed the principle of the experimental method that we have established, i.e., that, in the presence, of a well-noted new fact which contradicts a [prevailing] theory, instead of keeping the theory and abandoning the fact, I should keep and study the fact, and I hastened to give up the theory, … even when the theory [Avogadro's limit] is supported by great names and generally accepted24).” Hahnemann preceded Claude Bernard in introducing the experimental method in medicine by more than a half of a century25)] and pointed out in 1819 something very pertinent to our current discussion with skeptics, “How insignificant and ridiculous is mere theoretical skepticism in opposition to this unerring, infallible experimental proof26)!”

A very important factor that skeptics tend to not address in their calculation based on the theory of Avogadro's limit is the potential effects of the force of trituration and succussion applied in the preparation of UMPs. Rustum Roy and colleagues at the Materials Research Institute of Penn State University estimated that pressure shock waves generated by the process of trituration and succussion used in the preparation of UMPs can caused localized pressure inside the water, alcohol and sugar molecules to reach over 10,000-15,000 atmospheres (150,000-225,000 pounds per square inch), which is powerful enough to trigger fundamental changes in the properties of these vehicles27), 28).

Regarding the last part of this question, namely, “But this solution is then impregnated into a sugar pill and the water is evaporated. What then is left behind? And how does whatever is left behind have anything to do with healing?” When British astronomer Sir Patrick Moore wanted to emphasize that our comprehension of the universe is often quite incomplete, he would simply say, “We just don't know!” And this is exactly what the situation is at this point in time regarding this question, as the fundamental research on UMPs has so far been conducted with solutions only. To my knowledge, UMPs in solid forms have not yet been studied.

It is important here to point out here that fundamental research in homeopathy progress very slowly, as there are very few researchers studying this quite intriguing but extremely promising field of investigation, and also it is supported by minimal research grants. The worldwide budget for all the research in homeopathy is likely to be less than two million dollars per year. Funding usually comes from private foundations and homeopathic laboratories, and typical grants are of the order of $10,000 to $30,000. In comparison, funding for biomedical research in 2007 was over $100 billion for the US alone, which is about half of the total worldwide funding29). How ironic and sad it is that homeopathy, without any doubt the most important of all medical disciplines, receives less than 1/100,000 of all the moneys allocated in the world for bio-medical research!

References


1) Hahnemann reported this phenomenon in great detail and with many observations in 1796 in his Essay on a New Principle for Ascertaining the Curative Powers of Drugs. (In The Lesser Writings of Samuel Hahnemann. Collected and translated by R. E. Dudgeon. New York: William Radde, 1852: 249-303.) He confirmed this phenomenon during the 1799 scarlet fever epidemic in an article entitled On the Power of Small Doses of Medicine in General and of Belladonna in Particular. (In The Lesser Writings of Samuel Hahnemann. Collected and translated by R. E. Dudgeon. New York: William Radde, 1852: 385-389.
2) In a five month study in a large clinic, it was estimated that approximately 75% of patients with chronic diseases experienced an initial aggravation after taking the simillimum homeopathic remedy. (Paterakis S, Bachas I, Vithoulkas G. Statistical data on aggravation after the simillimum. Journal of the American Institute of Homeopathy 1977; 70: 267-269.
3) Already in 1786, four years before his experimentation with Peruvian bark, he was prescribing very small doses of mercury in his treatment of syphilitic patients compared to the much larger doses commonly prescribed by his contemporaries.
4) Even though Hahnemann made the experiment with Peruvian bark in 1790 and published the results of the first six years of his experiments by announcing a new therapeutic principle in 1796, he began using serial succussed dilutions (usually of the second or third attenuations) only in 1799 during the epidemic of scarlet fever. He would then mix one part of pulverized Opium with twenty parts of weak alcohol, would let this mixture stand in a cool place for a week and would shake it occasionally to “promote the solution.” A drop of this tincture was mixed “intimately” with five hundred drops of diluted alcohol, and the whole was well shaken; and of this last diluted tincture, one drop was added to another five hundred drops of alcohol. Of this diluted tincture, one drop sufficed for a child of four years of age (particularly during stupefaction marked with convulsions), and two drops for one of ten years. For still younger children, one drop of this dilution was mixed with ten teaspoonfuls of water, and one, two, or more spoonfuls given. He wrote, “It is unnecessary to repeat these doses oftener than every four or eight hours, in some case more than every twenty-four hours, and sometime a couple of times during the whole fever, for which the more frequent or more rare occurrence these symptoms must be our guide.” (Hahnemann S. Cure and Prevention of Scarlet Ferer. In The Lesser Writings of Samuel Hahnemann. Collected and translated by R. E. Dudgeon. New York: William Radde, 1852: 375.
5) After abandoning the practice of medicine because of its uncertainty, Hahnemann occupied himself mostly with chemistry and translation. He was soon recognized as an expert chemist. (To appreciate Hahnemann's work as a chemist see: Bradford TL. Life and Letters of Dr. Samuel Hahnemann. Philadelphia: Boericke & Tafel, 1895: 29-42, and Kleiner) It was said that his accomplishments in chemistry “must be termed remarkable… and [that he can be] added to the list of versatile scientists side by side with Lavoisier, Benjamin Franklin and Pasteur.” (Kleiner IS. Hahnemann as a chemist. Scientific Monthly 1938; 46: 450-454.) In his investigation on the fermentation of wine when put in contact with different gases, Hahnemann would fill vials with different gases and hermetically seal them under water. He would then succuss each vial up and down 30 times on a leather-bound book three times a day for a period of two months in order to increase the contact of the gases with the wine. (Hahnemann S. Ueber den Einfluss einiger Luftarten auf die Gährung des Weins. Chemische Annalen für die Freunde der Naturlehre, Arzneygelahrtheit, Haushaltungskunst und Manufakturen 1788; 1: 141-142.
6) The following extracts are from the Scholiast’s (believed to be Paracelsus) commentaries to the third section of The Golden Treatise of Hermes, “The dead elements (which a spirit inhabits) are revived; the composed bodies tinge and alter, or are altered; and by a wonderful process they are made permanent. … The bodies of the metals are domiciles of their spirits . . . when their terrestrial substance is by degrees made thin, extended, and purified, the life and fire hitherto lying dormant is excited and made to appear. For the life which dwells in the metals is laid, as it were, asleep (in sense); nor can it exert its powers or show itself unless the bodies (that is, the sensible and vegetable media of life) be first dissolved and turned into their radical source. …This is the property of our medicine, into which the previous bodies of the spirit are reduced; that, at first, one part thereof shall tinge ten parts of an imperfect body, then one hundred, then a thousand, and so infinitely on by which the efficacy of the Creative Word is wonderfully evidenced; and by how much oftener the medicine is dissolved, by so much the more it increases in virtue; which otherwise, and without any more solution, would remain in its single or simple state of perfection. Here, then, is a celestial and divine fountain set open which no man is able to draw dry.” (Cameron FT. Antiquity of the doctrine of dynamization of medicines by dilution. Organon 1878; 1: 280-281.) This accumulation in UMPs of the applied mechanical force is called “potentization” in homeopathy.
7) It is irrefutable from many authentic historical sources why Hahnemann first diminished the doses, and second how he proceeded very slowly through careful experimentation over many decades from prescribing simple dilutions to a progressive rise in serial trituration/succussion and dilutions, which has nothing to do at all with the skeptics' belief that Hahnemann “came to the conclusion, somehow nobody can explain how, that less is more.”
8) In 1798, two years after Hahnemann published the results of his experiments on a new therapeutic principle, he was still prescribing crude doses of medicine, such as a half-dram dose of Peruvian bark tincture (Some Periodical and Hebdomadal Diseases. In The Lesser Writings of Samuel Hahnemann. Collected and translated by R. E. Dudgeon. New York: William Radde, 1852: 341-344.), drop doses of tincture of Opium (Antidotes to Some Heroic Vegetable Substances. In The Lesser Writings of Samuel Hahnemann. Collected and translated by R. E. Dudgeon. New York: William Radde, 1852: 322-329.), and grain doses of Arnica Montana and Ignatia amara. (Some Kinds of Continued and Remittent Fevers. In The Lesser Writings of Samuel Hahnemann. Collected and translated by R. E. Dudgeon. New York: William Radde, 1852: 329-341.) By 1840, Hahnemann knew that a limit would unlikely ever be found to the efficacy of the higher potencies, as he kept increasing the potency of his remedies while observing increased remedial responses in the sick. Already in 1827, he suspected the unlimited potential of higher potencies when he wrote, “Medicinal substances are not dead masses in the ordinary sense of the term, on the contrary, their true essential nature is only dynamically spiritual—is pure force, which may be increased in potency by that most wonderful process of trituration (and succussion) according to the homeopathic method, almost to an infinite degree.” (Hahnemann S. How Can Small Doses of Such Very Attenuated Medicine as Homoeopathy Employs Still Possess Great Power? In The Lesser Writings of Samuel Hahnemann. Collected and translated by R. E. Dudgeon. New York: William Radde, 1852: 733.
9) Hahnemann referred to the doctrine of the divisibility of matter in 1810 (Hahnemann S. Organon of Medicine. Translated by Robert E. Dudgeon. Fifth American Edition. Philadelphia: Boericke & Tafel, 1912, 301.), and said in 1829 that “there must be an end to the thing [divisibility of matter], it cannot go on to infinity.” (Hahnemann S. Hahnemann's correspondence. British Journal of Homoeopathy 1847; 5: 398.) It is very unlikley that Hahnemann, who was an expert chemist, a great scholar and an accomplished scientisit, was not aware of Dalton's ideas on the atomic theory, which he presented between 1804 and 1810, and of the theory of Avogrado's limit, even though it would be determined much later. In 1811, Amadeo Avogadro proposed that the volume of a gas (at a given pressure and temperature) is proportional to the number of atoms or molecules regardless of the nature the gas. However, accurate determinations of Avogadro's number only became possible for the first time in 1910 after American physicist Robert Millikan measured the charge of an electron. The previous year, in 1909, French physicist Jean Perrin proposed the name of Avogadro to identify this fixed number of constituent particles in one mole of any given substance.
10) Hahnemann S. How Can Small Doses of Such Very Attenuated Medicine as Homoeopathy Employs Still Possess Great Power? In The Lesser Writings of Samuel Hahnemann. Collected and translated by R. E. Dudgeon. New York: William Radde, 1852: 729-730.
11) Ibid., 734.
12) Ultra-molecular preparations or UMPs are solids or solutions that went through the process of serial trituration/succussion and dilutions particular to homeopathy (or are solids, usually sugars, that have been impregnated with one of these solutions), and which usually exceed in theory Avogadro's limit.
13) Plazy M. Recherche expérimentale moderne en homéopathie. Angoulème: Éditions Coquemard, 1967, 13-15.
14) Chikramane PS, Kalita D, Suresh AK, Kane SG, Bellare JR. Why extreme dilutions reach non-zero asymptotes: a nanoparticulate hypothesis based on froth flotation. Langmuir 2012; 28: 15864-15875.
15) Wurmser L, Loch P. Travail de recherche expérimentale sur les dilutions homéopathiques. Congrès National de la Société Homéopathique de France 1948: 37-48.
16) tephenson J. A review of investigations into the action of substances in dilutions greater than 1 X 10-24. Journal of the American Institute of Homeopathy 1955; 48: 327-335.
17) Boericke GW, Smith RB. Modern aspects of homeopathic research. Journal of the American Institute of Homeopathy 1965; 58: 158-167; 1966; 59: 263-272.
18) Rey L. Thermoluminescence of ultra-high dilutions of lithium chloride and sodium chloride. Physica A 2003; 323: 67–74.
19) Elia V, Niccoli M. New physico-chemical properties of extremely diluted aqueous solutions. Journal of Thermal Analysis and Calorimetry 2004; 75: 815–836.
20) Elia V, Napoli E, Niccoli M, Tiezzi E. New physico-chemical properties of extremely dilute solutions. A conductivity study at 25°C in relation to ageing. Journal of Solution Chemistry 2008; 37: 85–96.
21) Scofield AM. Experimental research in homeopathy—a critical review. British Homoeopathic Journal 1984; 73: 161-180, 211-226.
22) Barnard GP. Microdose paradox—a new concept. Journal of the American Institute of Homeopathy 1965; 58; 205-212.
23) The full quote of Richter is as follows in German, ”Hahnemann, dieser seltene Doppelkopf von Philosophie und Gelehrsamkeit—dessen system am Ende den Ruin der gemeinen Receptier-köpfe nach sich ziehen muss, aber noch wenig von den Practikern angenommen und mehr verabscheut als untersucht ist.“ (Zerstreute Blätter, 2 Bd. S. 292.), and in its English translation, “Hahnemann, this rare combination of philosophy and learning, whose system must ultimately drag to destruction the vulgar receipt-crammed heads, but a system as yet little adopted by practitioners, and more detested than examined.” (Defence of Hahnemann and His Doctrines. Second edition. London: H. Ballière, 1844: 67.
24) Bernard C. Introduction à l'Étude de la Médecine Expériementale. Paris: J. B. Baillières et Fils, 1865: 287-288. (This passage can be found in Claude Bernard's An Introduction to the Study of Experimental Medicine. Translated by Henry Copley Green. New York: Dover Publications, 1957, 164.)
25) Hahnemann had clearly described the experimental method in The Medicine of Experience published in 1805 (Hahnemann S. Heilkunde der Erfahrung. Journal der practischen Heilkunde 1805; 22 (3); 5-99, or its English translation, in The Lesser Writings of Samuel Hahnemann. Collected and translated by R. E. Dudgeon. New York: William Radde, 1852: 435-476.
26) Hahnemann S. Organon der Heilkunst. Zweite vermehrte Auflage. Dresden: Arnoldischen Buchlandlung, 1819: 363.
27) Matthews R. The quantum elixir: water. It's the foundation of life on Earth. But what is it about H2O that gives it this amazing ability. New Scientist 2006; 190: 32-37.
28) Roy R, Slawecki T, Rao ML. Water, water everywhere; and so little understood. Lecture June 19, 2009. » http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8ajf_a9MRw.
29) Dorsey ER, Roulet JD, Thompson JP, Reminick JI, Thai A, White-Stellato Z, Beck CA, George BP, Moses H. Financial anatomy of biomedical research, 2003–2008. JAMA 2010; 303: 137–143.

DOCUMENT DESCRIPTOR

Source: http://www.homeopathy.ca/debates_2012-11-27_FromDrSchawrtz-to-DrSaine.shtml
Description: Questions posted by Dr. Joe Schwarcz to Dr. André Saine as a follow-up on the Debate held at McGill University on November 27, 2012.
Year: 2013
Editing: errors only; interlinks; formatting
Attribution: Legatum Homeopathicum
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en/misc/talk-qa-schwarcz-saine.1359616108.txt.gz · Last modified: 2013/01/31 07:08 by 80.86.255.130